http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2014-02-10/conversation-dr-francis-collins-director-nih
--in which not only did Dr. Francis Collins, head of the NIH, talk about the AMP, but also sang about it self-accompanied on his guitar (which, he explained, suitable for the former head of the Human Genome Project, has a double helix inlaid in mother-of-pearl on its fretboard).
I’ll let you enjoy the music if you wish on the audio and
turn straight to the written transcript.
Here’s how Dr. Collins explains the AMP:
So more than 1,000 new drug targets have emerged in the last five years from
that kind of study, but it's very hard to sift through them and pick out which
ones are going to be the real home runs that we're all looking for…. this is
full 50/50 skin-in-the-game kind of collaboration, $230 million committed to
this over five years, half of that coming from NIH, half of that coming from
the 10 companies that are participating. The scientists from both sectors will
sit around the same table and work together to make this happen in a fully open
access atmosphere…. We already have detailed research plans
for these disease areas that have been worked out over the past year with very
clear milestones that have to be met. This is not one of those where everybody
goes off and plays in the lab. We are really serious here about making real progress.
Well, in this phase of trying to identify the next generation of drug
targets, everybody agrees that this is precompetitive, and that is that all the
information has to be openly shared both within this consortium and for anybody
else who's watching. The competitiveness, Diane, kicks in once you've
identified, oh wow, that particular molecule is a really promising target for
the next generation of Alzheimer's therapy…. Then every company will run off and do what they do really well… And we
want them to do that. That's good competition. That means that things move
quickly and there's lots of ways that you can get to yes.
Let me see if I can make sense of this from the standpoint
of the view of current pharmaceutical science that I proposed in HOOKED. I
suggested then that the current drug pipelines were so dry because there are
only a limited number of molecules that do useful things in the human body
without killing us. Not that there would never again be a “golden age” of major
advances in drug therapy; but the new golden age would not come from drug
companies doing cranked-out research on their assembly line—it would require
breakthroughs in our basic understanding of disease, discoveries that the NIH
and academic centers are better able to make than industrial labs. So Take Home
Message #1, I hear Dr. Collins saying that we’re poised to enter another age of
advancement, that basic science research has now identified a bunch of exciting
new possibilities—locks that we now need to discover the keys to.
Take Home Message #2 seems to be that the “translational
science” model, which NIH has embraced in the last decade, tells them that
we’re now ready for a more accelerated and focused phase of discovery, when NIH
scientists and Pharma scientists can both participate in a program that will quickly move (as the translational
mantra has it) from (lab) bench to bedside. At this point, as a complete
non-expert, I would enter a note of caution. I generally support the
translational science model (full disclosure: a small portion of my salary is
currently funded under a translational science grant, to address the ethical
issues). However, there are times in the life cycle of a discovery when you can
safely go on the fast track and other times when you’d be better off “playing
in the lab” just a little bit longer. I hope the NIH gurus are right that their
particular list of diseases—Alzheimers, diabetes, and autoimmune disease—is
truly ready for this hurry-up approach.
OK, so that’s the science part; what about the
potential-conflict-of-interest part, the rocks on which so many previous
scientific ships have broken up and sank? Says Dr. Collins:
With regard to the drug companies, I know that people are concerned about
what their motives are. Again, they make pills. NIH doesn't. … We believe, by
working together, we can speed up the process of getting the right answers. … You know, five years ago, I don't think
this [collaboration] would have been possible. I think it's a combination of
scientific opportunity that is so exciting but so overwhelming that no company
can tackle it on their own, plus their own anxieties about the failures that
are all too common, even now, in drug trials where you've spent hundreds of
millions of dollars and you get to the end of that Phase III trial and it
didn't work. They've had enough of that, and they're anxious to try something
different.
So two things here—first, with a demand for open access, NIH
figures they have a safeguard against one of the main dangers of industry
collaborations of the past; and second, they believe that the drug industry
today is in a different place and more willing to play nicely in the sandbox.
Interestingly, Dr. Collins made a comment similar to one I have made previously
in this blog—
http://brodyhooked.blogspot.com/2011/08/in-praise-of-good-corporate-behavior.html:
[Rehm] I'm interested that Johnson & Johnson hired Yale University to oversee
the sharing of clinical trial data. What can you tell us about that? [Collins]
I think that's
fascinating. So the person at Yale University, Mr. Harlan Krumholz, who's a
cardiologist, who is a wonderful leader in this whole idea about getting
information out there where everybody can see it -- and he has a lot of
credibility so people will believe that if Harlan is involved that what Johnson
& Johnson proposes to do is the real deal and not just some window
dressing. I think it's great.
Final conclusion I’d offer: NIH seems to be
going into the AMP with decent reasons and with eyes open, but so far, Pharma
has an excellent track record of managing to have such folks for lunch
nonetheless. I hope Dr. Collins is right and this time it will be different,
and if so, we may have yet another good model of positive collaboration to work
with. Stay tuned.
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